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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i'm trying to read as much as i can about this before posting so that i at least sound like i know what i'm talking about, but has anybody tried it with their 450? i REALLY like the clean empty look achieved by not having a big honking battery hanging down in between my filters. i know the purists here might have some issues with this. chime in, let me here it. with this mod you remove the electric start capability, right? but if done right, losing the weight and creating a nice clean look- why isn't this done more often or is it and i just don't hear about it?

it looks there are kits made for this modification for all kinds of bikes out there but has anyone had any personal experience with one and a 450?
 

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Sensei
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The 450 Honda will NOT run really well without a battery, and although you CAN modify the charging system to allow it to do so, I wouldn't recommend it.....Battery ignitions tend to require batteries...
You can modify/buy and install a magneto ignition... BUT $$$$$$$...
A smaller 12 V battery carefully concealed behind the engine, under the swingarm pivot is the better way to go IF your lighting needs are minimal....
 

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this bike is a similiar look i'm after with my ST450 honda... tho with double disk 750 front end. I'm planning to run a sealed battery behind the frame downtube, the battery getting covered with simple SS plate on both sides... as would number plates. I have seen others run the battery under the hump of seat also. danWI
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
A smaller 12 V battery carefully concealed behind the engine, under the swingarm pivot is the better way to go IF your lighting needs are minimal....
steve,
tell me more about this. under the swingarm? how small is this battery your talking about? have any pictures or references to a particular one i might look?

seth
 

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Seth... A 12N7 or 12N5.5 are nominally sufficient to run the ignition and/or minimal lighting....You DO have to remove the centerstand..... Dimensions for these are available online.... Make a cardboard mock-up of the battery (size) and figure the best way to "fit' it in there, then fabricate a battery cage (box) to do so....
You will also need to disable the yellow to white "overcharge" connection as you'll "cook' the smaller battery otherwise... (Just unplug the white lead where it comes out of the alt, and tape it up....)
 

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check out speedcell supersport batteries, they want real money (160), but they are small very light and advertised as capable of powering a modern 600 supersport estart and all. I'm in the process of making my own, should save about 50% mostly I'm just satisfying my curiosity while hopefully learning something interesting (and making a cool battery in the process)
 

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Hmmm... My CB450K7 runs just fine with a couple of copasiters in place of the battery. Have to have the rpms up to turn the lights on, but once they are on it idols fine with just some light flicker. Oh ya, cant honk my horn at idol without dying. Caps cost $3each.
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well, thats creative l5cygx! how does the heat of summer running effect the capacitor's output? i'd guess this would be good for a race application but I'd be concerned with daily city driving... danWI
 

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What do you use to excite the field to start the bike?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
yeah, interesting use of capacitors. how reliable are they really? you MUST rev at stops in order for the lights to stay on or just to have them come on? kickstart only?

i'm sold on the speedcell supersport batteries suggested earlier AND i'm still considering steve's option of a smaller battery mounted below the swing. dumb question maybe, but can an acid battery be laid horizontally and still work effectively? trying to work out some of the fabricated housing details in my head here at "Initech."
 

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No question is dumb.... and NO it must be nearly vertical...(The acid fluid must cover the plates or they'll sulfate...laying it down would expose some of the plates)............
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Exactly GB... Lots of TPS reports tomorrow!
 

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Get a lil bit bigger seat and then a gel batter. Tuck everything underneath.

The result is

 

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I rode my bike around for about a month with the caps (no battery). If the bike had been sitting for a few hours it would take a few kicks to get the caps primed and you cant start it with any of the lights in the on position. (I even considerd disconnecting the neutral indicator). Kickstart only - (the bike has no juice until the motor is running). To turn the lights on I had to bring the rpms up to about 2500 initially, after they were on it would idol fine with a bit of headlight flicker. If I wanted to use the horn I had to have her at about 2500rps or she would stall. My bike would start with one kick if it had been running within the past few hours, if not, five kicks was plenty. I would still be riding it that way but I got a fix it ticket for no mufflers (Huntington Beach cops hate loud bikes) so I decided it was time to do a full build. I liked the caps and will probably run that way again when I am done with the rebuild (if I ever get done, I have a thread in the 'projects' section -'74 CB450 cafe Hopefull-) It definatly gave the bike a personality and if you didnt know her you would not like riding it, but I was in tune with her and commuted twenty miles a day like that no problem. (until the cops caught me!)
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Sorry, can't figure out how to remove the fuzzy picture...
 

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unfortunately caps are quite weak when it comes to storing current, 1 farad is 1 volt amp second, so it would stand to reason a 1f cap could crap out 12 a for one second. enough for your horn.. unfortunately they ususaly are about the size of a water bottle to have that sort of capacity, so they end up being a filter to smoth out the power pulses from the generator
 

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Exactly ihatespeed. I have two 35v 4700uf capacitors running in paralell acting as a surge supressor/distributer for the pulses from the generator. One works fine but the more/bigger the better. If you try this be carefull as a capacitor with a charge can discharge all at once shocking the hell out of you, DO NOT TOUCH BOTH LEADS UNLESS YOU HAVE DISCHARGED THE CAP! I've been told it could be leathal. correct me if I am wrong.
 

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l5cygx said:
Exactly ihatespeed. I have two 35v 4700uf capacitors running in paralell acting as a surge supressor/distributer for the pulses from the generator. One works fine but the more/bigger the better. If you try this be carefull as a capacitor with a charge can discharge all at once shocking the hell out of you, DO NOT TOUCH BOTH LEADS UNLESS YOU HAVE DISCHARGED THE CAP! I've been told it could be leathal. correct me if I am wrong.
I guess any sort of electrical shock can be lethal but 35v with so little current probably won't do any damage. On the other hand, many years ago I used to be an eletronics tech and we worked on some equipment with huge Caps and tubes. We'd have to use a shorting bar to short the caps out and sometimes they'd throw an arc for 6 or 7 inches so it's wise to be careful none-the-less.
 

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MNellis
That was not in LORAN was it? even from the much smaller c transmitters some of the caps are the size of a 5 gallon pail..
 

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ihatespeed said:
MNellis
That was not in LORAN was it? even from the much smaller c transmitters some of the caps are the size of a 5 gallon pail..

No, it was an old TACAN unit at NAS Moffett Field back in '76.
 
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