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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I'm looking at my 450CL cam and its missing three of the cam rings and the other fell out. I have seen pictures of other bikes with that ring just hanging on the cam. I was thinking I'd replace the missing ones but wanted to know if there's a trick to installing them so that they don't fall out again. Or is the vote to just leave them out?

Also, there is an electric starter repair shop nearby. Like all Honda starters, mine doesn't work. Would they be able to fix it? I seem to recall you need a Honda 350 axle bolt to disassemble the starter (I do have a Honda 350).

Thanks!
 

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you should find all the broken pieces in the bottom of your crank case and then get rid of the remaining ring. These things will fall apart after some time and block some oil passages . They are not required.
 

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So I'm looking at my 450CL cam and its missing three of the cam rings and the other fell out. I have seen pictures of other bikes with that ring just hanging on the cam. I was thinking I'd replace the missing ones but wanted to know if there's a trick to installing them so that they don't fall out again. Or is the vote to just leave them out?

Also, there is an electric starter repair shop nearby. Like all Honda starters, mine doesn't work. Would they be able to fix it? I seem to recall you need a Honda 350 axle bolt to disassemble the starter (I do have a Honda 350).

Thanks!
^^^+1 on removing the rubber rings on the cams, they're there to help reduce cam chain noise and nothing more. As for your starter, if the starter motor seems to spin normally then the likely culprit is the starter clutch on the back of the alternator rotor which, from looking at some of your older threads, it seems you may have worked on before. Other than replacing the caps, springs and sometimes the rollers, if it still slips then the outer housing that attaches with 3 tapered headed screws to the back of the alternator rotor may have a crack in it and if so, will need to be replaced
 

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I think you're right about the axle as a rotor popper-offer. Or you could by the tool for about $10 from Motion Pro (or other places).
Jumper a good 12 volt battery directly to your starter, where the big cable connects. If the starter spins, then the starter itself is fine, problem is somewhere else.

As for the cam rubber rings, it's your decision. Lots of guys say they don't matter. I think maybe Honda put them there for a reason, so I always put them in - of course that entails a complete top end teardown......
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I think you're right about the axle as a rotor popper-offer. Or you could by the tool for about $10 from Motion Pro (or other places).
Jumper a good 12 volt battery directly to your starter, where the big cable connects. If the starter spins, then the starter itself is fine, problem is somewhere else.

As for the cam rubber rings, it's your decision. Lots of guys say they don't matter. I think maybe Honda put them there for a reason, so I always put them in - of course that entails a complete top end teardown......
I blew a head gasket so have cut the cam chain and sent the heads to a shop for inspection and will have new bronze valve guides added. Looks like the cams come out pretty easy. But don't want to replace the rubber rings if they're just going to fall out again and cause problems. I see squared edges on the one that's left. Is there a way to install without them coming out?

It seems clear to me that there's a wrong way to do it.

Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
^^^+1 on removing the rubber rings on the cams, they're there to help reduce cam chain noise and nothing more. As for your starter, if the starter motor seems to spin normally then the likely culprit is the starter clutch on the back of the alternator rotor which, from looking at some of your older threads, it seems you may have worked on before. Other than replacing the caps, springs and sometimes the rollers, if it still slips then the outer housing that attaches with 3 tapered headed screws to the back of the alternator rotor may have a crack in it and if so, will need to be replaced

Thank you!
 

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I blew a head gasket so have cut the cam chain and sent the heads to a shop for inspection and will have new bronze valve guides added. Looks like the cams come out pretty easy. But don't want to replace the rubber rings if they're just going to fall out again and cause problems. I see squared edges on the one that's left. Is there a way to install without them coming out?

It seems clear to me that there's a wrong way to do it.

Thanks!
It's not a "right or wrong way to install them" issue that causes them to fall out, it's that the rubber gets baked by the engine heat (the exhaust side usually goes faster as the exhaust cam runs hotter) and then they crack and centrifugal force slings them out eventually. They are just square o-rings and if you remove the cams to replace them, they simply slip into the groove. Yes, Honda put them there for a reason, Honda always has a reason for what they do - not that they've ever said anything openly about them that I'm aware of, could be a service bulletin somewhere about it I guess, maybe early in the 450's production - but the best I can tell it was for cam chain noise to make the engine quieter mechanically. Back then, Hondas were quiet, oil-tight and reliable to counter the lingering public perception of motorcycles in general left over from the '40s and '50s when loud American V-twins roamed the country and (the bad guys who rode some of them) terrorized small towns and car drivers, and terrorized sidewalks and driveways with oil leaks where they parked
 

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New cam rings are very tight, once installed they won't "fall" out.
Use a 90-degree pick to stretch them into place, no problemo......
 
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