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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello. I had my bike (72 CB450) running pretty good with my points. I've always been a bit suspicious of my mechanical advance and I didn't want to have to deal with re-adjusting my points, so bought my Pamco in hopes to gain a bit more performance (and simply treat myself). Bought myself a timing light. Set my unit's notch up centred with the default points case marking. Kicked over pretty well. Still following along with the instructions... I am so far off getting both left and right firing marks lined up I'm not sure what could be wrong.

For example, if I line up F with my strobe (plate turned just clockwise of the notch), my left cylinder is firing before the left advance mark, like 1 1/2" advanced! If I line up LF, my F mark goes out of range. Way more than the pc and hall sensor tweaking can accommodate for.

I thought I might just have to swap the coil wires from the e-advance, but the colours match up (and it didn't want to start the other way around).

I have quite a new cam chain installed, and reset my chain tensioner. Pretty sure my cam/valve timing is on the marks. I'm running out of ideas, and thinking something is messed up.

PS: I'm still learning to navigate this site as I'm fairly new. I've done a few hours of searching but having difficulty finding any pertinent solutions. Any help would be much appreciated.
 

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I've not used a Pamco but I've seen people here that had to do some serious modifications to the positioning of one of the sensors to get the other cylinder right. If the bike runs on points and seems normal, I'm sure your cam timing is right and even a slight looseness in the cam chain isn't going to cause that kind of error in your ignition timing or it would have with the points too. To better find subjects here in the forum, it has been suggested (and works for me) that you do a Google search for the subject and add Honda Twins to the end of the question, it seems to work better than the search box here
 

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MAN... you guys REALY love your points! :)
Wheeler.. I have read some recent post about adjusting one of the hall sensors.. I believe Pamco Pete also added a suggested way of doing this. And for people skittish about modifying anything, I believe he (or someone) suggested " splitting the difference" between the cylinders..
 

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MAN... you guys REALY love your points! :)
Actually Rob, I just like having one less thing to wonder about when troubleshooting... points are easily diagnosed, electronics obviously not so much, and electronics fail when and where they want to with little or no hope of limping home. That's why I'll probably start looking backwards in years for a replacement car when my PT dies of some large, expensive and not cost-effective repair down the road. I've had enough of computer (ECM/BCM) failures and expenses leading to spending almost as much money on that alone in 8 years of ownership as all the other maintenance on the car combined.
 

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As every year passes I agree more and more with the above statement. All these supposed technological advances and we seem to be regressing as a society. Simple is better! My next car will probably be and old VW Bug.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for the replies. I have a hard time believing my Pamco is to fault right out of the box, but may be acting like a wakeup call. I think I need to go back and check my cam timing. I set it a few months back with a new chain and was happy to see how perfectly my marks lined up after getting rid of my old chain, and setting my points got a lot easier after that. it possible to jump a tooth? If so, what can cause this.. worn guide rollers, tensioner, tight link? My last compression check was around 160 warm on fairly new pistons / rings / bore, was hoping for better. Now thinking my valves are not seating and losing compression. Gonna check things out again. Deep breath.. I'll be back.
 

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Dad and Scott.. I'm with you 100%.. simple IS BETTER. and I am STILL learning about "Dwell" and how it effects coil saturation.... YouTube is friggn awesome!!!
For me it's the whole 2 points / 2 condensers (my old triumph) that Drove me crazy ... after installing a EI on it .. it was like a new motor.. I just didn't take the time to learn.. wanted to get it back together (Holed a piston either from intake leak or one cylinder timing was advanced to far)...
and I do like the fact that you can pretty much hook up a 9v battery or just the charging system to get u home on points if ur battery crappy out.
I miss non catalytic motors and leaded gas...
 

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Not sure about jumping a tooth... but it wouldn't hurt to double check. Your system MAY be at fault, like I said I have read threads where people HAVE adjusted / moved the sensors to get the timing "spot on"..
If I remeber it correctly.. loosen the sensor plates, move them "out" / away from each other as far as they will allow.. tighten one, set that cylinders mark with the plate.. move to the other and TRY to set that mark by moving THAT hall sensor...
I also read where prople have "bent" / moved the hall sensor out / away from the magnets...
As the hall sensor plates are not permantly mounted to the plate. You could probubly elongate the mounting screw holes (without damaging the circuit) to adjust THAT cylinder's firing position
 

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...it possible to jump a tooth? If so, what can cause this.. worn guide rollers, tensioner, tight link? My last compression check was around 160 warm on fairly new pistons / rings / bore, was hoping for better. Now thinking my valves are not seating and losing compression.
It is possible to jump a tooth, but only under extreme circumstances of really loose and worn cam chain and rollers/guides AFAIK. If your bike is running decently (with the previous ignition) and compression is 160, checking your valves is just a regular maintenance item and I can't imagine much if any significant leakage. Always start with the simplest things first - spark, properly timed, fuel and compression. You might be overthinking it and causing yourself undue angst
 

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OCD will not allow you to even imagine that the most modern technologically advanced part on your motorcycle could be total crap.:confused:
TOOLS
 

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You can make some fairly large adjustments in the advance/retard by moving the small pick up. That is the small black piece with 3 legs. I moved the one on my 350 pamco unit a slight amount and moved it close to 10 degrees. If you did both you could bring them much closer.

Make sure you do not have the wiring for the unit running parallel to the sparkplug wires, wrapped around each other or excess wiring put into a loop. You can get a lot of interference happening.
 

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Actually Rob, I just like having one less thing to wonder about when troubleshooting... points are easily diagnosed, electronics obviously not so much, and electronics fail when and where they want to with little or no hope of limping home. That's why I'll probably start looking backwards in years for a replacement car when my PT dies of some large, expensive and not cost-effective repair down the road. I've had enough of computer (ECM/BCM) failures and expenses leading to spending almost as much money on that alone in 8 years of ownership as all the other maintenance on the car combined.
Tangential to the Pamco discussion, but salient to your thoughts above-
I recently had yet another clothes-washer failure, on one of these new-fangled computerized high-efficiency machines, the kind with a little impeller on the bottom of the tub and that uses very little water.
This is the 5'th one I've gone through - they do a terrible job on clothes, then every few years the "computer board" goes bad - a $250 part plus a service call.
I finally had enough - not only of the washers, but of wifey bitchin' at me every time it happened. So I went out and bought a pricey Speed-Queen washer - totally industrial strength and old-school technology, this thing weighs a ton. No circuit boards, no micro-chips, no logic circuits, just good ol' mechanical switches and relays like the old days. Even has a big ol' agitator thing to move stuff around. It's noisier and uses more water, but it does a terrific job and many users report 25 years or better of faithful service.

As you might guess, I've never been tempted to mess around with Pamco or any of the other EI stuff.
 

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Yup.. speed queens are "pricy".. but no plastic gears or electronics..,if (when) the one I have dies..
speed queen it is!!!
I'll be able to put it in my will to be passed down...
 

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^^^yep Bill, we bought top load Samsung last time (just don't care for front load, we're not running a laundramat) and though they are electronic/solenoid controlled, they've held up well for the last 6 to 7 years... (knocking on wood as I type this) but I absolutely hear you on the excess electronics
 

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If you have a cam timing issue always set to advanced position. Chain stretch and wear will correct it

Sent from my SM-J320V using Tapatalk
 

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Hey Guys. You might want to check with Pete with Pamco. I bought an ignition for my 1970 CB350. It came in, I didn't have time to install it due to my work schedule, so I dropped the bike and ignition off to my mechanic. He needed to clean the carbs on the bike anyway. I finally heard back from him, he said he couldn't get the ignition to work. I was thinking like you guys were thinking about it might have jumped a tooth are something like that. After researching all the pictures I could find on the web, I determined that my pick up plate didn't look like it was in the correct position that I thought it should be in. Through the distributor I bought it from, they gave me Pete's email address. I contacted him about my problem and sent pictures with some explanations and questions about it. He more or less "blew me off" with the check the videos on my site response. I personally don't think he made through half of my email before he fired the "idiot" response to me. We went back and forth some I mentioned that it looked as though the plate was flipped, I also asked if the rotor or plate might be from a 360. He responded saying that the rotor and 360 parts were not interchangeable...on and on... With my last response and with another picture, I explained how the adjustment slot on the pick up plate was almost 180 degrees away from the adjustment slot on the engine. He responded and said to send it to him so he can determine what I have and what I need. So I sent it. I sent emails trying to check on it about every two weeks with no response. I even sent a copy of the delivery receipt one time, still with no response. I also bugged the distributor, and they tried to get in touch with him with no results. Finally he responded to a email AFTER THREE AND A HALF MONTHS!! and says" Sorry about the delay, you have a 350 pack and a 360 pick up plate. Did you buy two systems and get the parts mixed up.... I was LIVID !! After I explained that I sent him exactly what I received!! He responds and says he'll send a replacement out tomorrow. A few days later I receive it, install it, wire it, put fresh gas in the tank. It fired off on the first try!!!
So, sorry to drag ya'll through this long story, but ]IT IS HIGHLY POSSIBLE THAT YOU HAVE THE INCORRECT PARTS TOO!! I would first check on that first and foremost before spending time working on anything else. If you do check into, possibly having the incorrect parts, good luck getting a response out of Pete!! Thanks to Ol Pete, 90% of my summer riding has been wasted. I was also very surprised that he had no genuine remorse for a problem caused totally by him. Also, I'm out the time my mechanic charged me to trouble shoot the problem that PETE caused !!!!!!!!
 

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..,go ahead and beat it!.. as much as I like the system I have...warrenty doesn't mean **** of customer service treats customers like crap. 3.5 months is unacceptable in my book..even with family stuff or health stuff .. in today's world a "batch" e mail could be sent from a phone in 60 seconds ... just to let customers "we r having issues please be patient... will contact you as soon as we can"..
Sad that the system Peet built and designed works better than his customer service..
There should be a disclaimer when purchasing one of these..
"Be forewarned, Yes, this system comes with a year warrenty... however.. getting a response from the manufacture within a reasonable time will be a crap shoot, and vendors will just direct you to the manufacture"..
 
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