[dandanrevolution]

Hokay so..

I was having some gear shift problems so I decided to split the lower crankcase and see if everything was to spec. I did so, and everything was. I put some sealant down, hand-tightened the crankcase bolts, reattached the clutch basket and reattached the oil filter rotor. The oil filter rotor is attached by a lock nut and washer inside the oil filter rotor. When tightening the lock nut, the oil filter rotor and clutch assembly catch (the gears do not move), allowing the lock nut to be tightened. I assume this is how it should work.

Of course, when I was tightening the bolts to the lower crankcase back up, I broke a bolt. DOH! Sooo, I take off the oil filter rotor and clutch basket and split the lower crankcase again to remove the broken piece of bolt. So I put sealant down again, hand tighten the lower crankcase bolts, reattach the clutch basket assembly, go to reattach the oil filter rotor but run into a problem---- this time, the oil filter rotor rotates freely in either direction, so the lock nut cannot be tightened. No matter what gear I have it in, I can spin the oil filter as much as I want and nothing ever catches or grabs. This seems like a red flag to me, so I stopped for the night. And now I'm turning to the wise world of hondatwins to steer me in the right direction, as I can come up with no theories of my own at the moment.

Any ideas on what I could have done differently the second time around?

Thanks,
Dan

 

[Bird76Mojo]

From what I remember it does rotate freely but I could be wrong. I can't say why it didn't turn the first time? Once you hear from the others here on that, you can hold the rear brake to tighten it or wedge a penny between the gears to tighten it.


GB :mrgreen:

 

[kirkn]

Yep - it should rotate in either direction freely.

The oil filter rotor (the centrifugal slinger) is attached directly to the crankshaft which must be free to rotate in either direction.

Clutch drives the transmission, which also must rotate fully in either direction.

I wedge a rag between the gears. A thick enough wad of rag will not pinch thru the gears (filter-to-clutch) and it'll stop the rotation.

Not sure WHY yours locked up, perhaps a set of gears in the transmission wasn't meshing properly, but it's actually good that you had to go back in. Something wasn't right that first time around...

 

[NOS351WCM]

I used a penny when reassembling my oil filter on my cb450. It should spin freely even if the trans is in gear.

 

[dandanrevolution]

No kiddin??

Well i wish i could have figured that out through logic and reason but i'll take all the dumb luck I can get too.

Thanks for your help guys.

 

[Sharkmonkey]

Uhh, mine doesn't spin freely and that makes sense to me. It necessarily must spin with the crankshaft otherwise it can't filter. That lock nut goes on with 33-40 ft-lbs of torque, not zero. And the filter rotor is splined onto the the crankshaft (this is all per the service manual). Or am I confused about something here?

 

[Bike-Mart]

Dan
You say it spins freely, do you mean WITH the crankshaft or independantly of?
It should be splined onto crank, but crank then should spin freely.

 

[dandanrevolution]

Yeah, I'm sorry. Maybe "spins freely" was a confusing choice of words.

I'm not sure I know what "splined" means but I think I'm understanding it in context.

The oil filter is on the end of the crankshaft, right in front of the primary drive gear when looking from the right crankcase side. They all rotate together. But the primary drive gear meshes gears with the clutch outer. This is what I was referring to that used to catch or freeze so that the I could tighten the lock not on the oil filter rotor (at 33-40 ft-lbs, as sharkmonkey said).

Sorry everyone, I'm sure my lack of mechanical vocabulary is making this a lot harder than it is. Here is a picture:

[attachment=0:2lfhcef4]0804102033-00.jpg[/attachment:2lfhcef4]

Basically, everything now moves unhindered. Where as it used to stop, allowing me to tighten or loosen the oil filter lock nut. Just curious as to which is correct.

 

[Sharkmonkey]

In that particular configuration (engine on table, no cylinders) I would expect it to move relatively freely all the time, since you have nothing to resist the rotation of the crankshaft. If you had it that way before and got resistance, something wasn't right there. You need either compression or mechanical linkage to resist it. If the lower is back in the bike with the chain on and in gear, then you should be able to tighten it. With the cylinders and head on, you should be able to tighten it some, but I expect not to full torque.

 

[Wear'nWrals]

BUMP Old thread but relevant question: why does the manual say to get a new lockwasher? Can't you just bend down a new tab on the old one?

 

[crazypj]

If it's tightened correctly, it will be in the exact same place as when it was removed. Ergo, the tab will be the one you straightened out.
It can (and often does) break off if you try and re-use it. Because there is a range in the torque spec, it going slightly tighter normally allows a different tab to be used
The nut should be fitted with the chamfer towards inside, makes tabbing easier and tabs less likely to break compared to a sharp 90 degree bend

 

[metu71]

I think there is nothing wrong using the old lock washer, but those tabs tend to break loose when twisted many times. You may be able to twist the tab back without breaking it when you assemble the engine, but if it was almost broken it can fall off while engine is running. Loose piece of a metal in an engine is not a good thing. Before reusing it try to check that the tabs are still firm, usually those can take few bends before loosing their stiffness.

 

[frogman79]

SOME locks like these can be FLIPPED over and reused...

 

[JAYinNY]

Get a new lock washer. They are still available and are dirt cheap. Why take a chance.

 

[Yendor]

Yes - +1 on get a new lock washer. They are cheap enough to just buy a stock of 5 or 10 and keep them handy for future oil changes

 

[66Sprint]

Sorry, I just don't "get" why you are removing the "body" of the centrifugal filter (and having to replace the lockwasher) for just an oil change......
(However, IF you remove it, it is best to replace it with a NEW lockwasher).......
It does NOT need to be removed just to clean it, or during oil changes....Only needs to be removed to access/remove the clutch/oil-pump/primary drive pinion, etc.....
Remove the cap (the bladed impeller part), as per your manual, scrape the heavier "mung" out of the rotor (the "body" cup), and spray it clean with carb cleaner.....
Wipe dry, install cleaned cap with NEW o-ring, secure it, (circlip or screw).....
IF/WHEN you have removed the larger right-side clutch cover to access/clean the oil pump pick-up screen, I recommend re-adding oil to the assembled filter and (on bikes equipped with the removable, round, three oval head-screw- outer cover) filling the passage from the pump with clean oil from a pump-type oil-can....This will "back-fill to the check-valve and expedite oil reaching the top end during restart......