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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well, I guess it's time for me to get back to the project that first brought me to Hondatwins....
Several members have 160, 175, and 200 projects already going, so I'll add mine back in....

The bike I'm rebuilding/modifying started life as a regular old 1971 CL175 that I picked up titled for cheap..... I also have the left-over parts-bikes parts (about 3 bikes worth) from my "Mini-Bobber" build, so this should be a relatively rapid process....
...YEA, RIGHT!.... That was sometime back in 2004....

Then one day, as I was shuffling the bikes and parts around to make room to work in the shop, inspiration struck!....It dawned on me that I had almost enough variety of parts to allow me to build a somewhat close-to-vintage-looking representation of the period Hondas, .....

Step 1... Use the existing front end and frame, but eventually add the headlight and ears off a 160 to give the correct headlight/speedo combination "look" (very 60's)...( Of course, I'll HAVE to modify the light to hold a halogen lamp......).... Mock it up and stare a bit.............



Well, THAT tank won't do.....so plop on the 68 CL 175 tank..... It doesn't fit...YET....
A bit of "hammer adjustment" on the tunnel shape, some paint...add the pads and emblems,
Add headlight assembly, fender, some bars.... Stare a bit again....



Closer to the mental image, but not quite..... Search the web and find this:



and this:



The little thing shows promise!.......Gotta swap the fenders and add the engine for the next mock-up...........



NOW we're getting somewhere!...... More next post......:D :D :D Steve
 

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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
IF ONLY I had a "sloper" engine.....Wait a minute, I do!.... The '68 CL 175 that provided the headlight and tank has a locked-up one.....Attempt to trial fit it...and....It doesn't fit....YET!
Some careful measuring, and a cut-off wheel on the die-grinder later.....and in it goes....





Awfully tight, but I have a way to solve that......Swap top head covers!....



But while it's in there, let's trial fit the pipes......



Then try the 305 steering damper.......



It's getting closer!......Next, I have to fab up some motor mounts, and damper mounts....
 

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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks, Deacon!...... :D

As with any project where one uses parts not originally on that particular bike, there are LOTS of small modifications (tweaks) required...... I'm trying to end up with a bike that looks like it COULD have come "that way" from the factory, and still is completely different from anything anyone else has.............Finding the correct balance between looking "stock" and actually being unique is the part I enjoy most......
I have lots more pictures that show some of those "tweaks", but don't want to overload the posts with excessive details unless there is enough interest..... Steve
 

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10,203 Posts
I love that concept:

If you've got a torch and a welder it will fit!
 

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2,386 Posts
Great looking job so far Steve. I like the look of the slightly longer tank with the pads.
 

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1,431 Posts
Love where it's going. Can't wait to see more
 

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Steve, thanks for going through your thought process: decisions and indecisions. Very enjoyable and engaging.

I know for me, for the most part, I have to stick with the parts that came with the bike. Its real refreshing to see someone with the resources, knowledge and skills to be able to swap different parts. Should make for a unique and interesting bike.
 

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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
OK then.....
The reasons I want to build this "looks-like" bike rather than just building a 305, are that I have the parts (well, most of them), I'm a runt (5'7" and thin)...and I'm cheap... :lol:
The actual 305 scramblers just felt a bit too heavy and awkward when I had them out in the "dirt" ... But, I LOVED how they looked and sounded! .....So, this exercise presented a challenge for me to build (always a good, fun thing) and would result in a new "toy" I could enjoy riding on AND off road......Win/Win.....
Once I got the front ends to somewhat closely resemble each other, I could see that I COULD build a complete bike that "suggested/resembled" the 60's models but had the advantage of all the improvements made up until the 80's.....

My front-end comparison:


If I add a slightly larger ("meatier") universal tread tire and CL bars, I think it will be very close in appearance...at least as close as it needs to be.......

The front end was fairly easy... The real effort would be in fitting the "Sloper" engine, and fabricating the numerous bits and brackets required...The original "Vertical" engine was simply bolted with brackets into a complete frame.... The "Sloper", however was designed to be a part of the frame (stressed member), so its mounting points were heavier, wider, and at slightly different locations..... Fortunately, the two rear mount points are spaced vertically the same on both engines....
Keeping the left rear engine mounts on both the frame and engine, and using them as a reference point, (so the sprockets would align properly), I simply removed just enough of the '71 frame to allow me to install the sloper engine by rotating it into place.... Bolting it to the remaining left-rear engine mounts and shimming it to the correct position allowed me to plan, fit, and measure for the replacement right rear engine mount plates.....To allow the original brake light switch to be used, I had to make up two separate plates, each triangulated on two bolts that would run completely through the existing frame...To re-strengthen the area where these holes are drilled, I'll weld in lengths of 3/8 "steam" piping (heavy wall) which just happen to fit 8 mm bolts very closely.....(Not done yet as all the cutting/fitting was done on a "spare" frame for "practice")

Pics will be edited in here as that occurs on the frame I'll actually be using.......

..........(Is this too deep into the process, or ....?) Steve
 

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i do love the processs details! please continue :)
 

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Sensei
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
My thinking was this: If I make up TWO slightly different sets of rear motor mounts, I could use either style engine ...(the "Vert" breathes better and produces a little bit more HP to ride and enjoy, and I could simply swap-in the "sloper" when I was displaying it at the local bike shows, as it would "look" more correct)....Then it dawned on me that I could possibly assemble a "Sloper-Vert" hybrid .....(Sloper bottom end with vertical top end)....The best of both worlds....

Since both engines use the identical top end gaskets, How far off could they be?

Turns out, they are a good deal different...(see pics below).... The carbs mount at completely different angles, on differently flanged intakes...The pipes exit at different angles which will only be compounded by "leaning" the vertical top end forwards to mount it on the sloper cases...But, I HAD already intended to use vert carbs regardless, because the sloper ones were pretty far gone..... So how much more work would it be to re-do the pipes?......LOL..... I was already swapping the head covers due to clearance issues..........





It may be easier to conceptualize if you see the two engines complete with carbs and pipes....... First, the vert in the mini, then a beautiful example (not mine unfortunately) of Sloper engine.....



(the sloper belongs to " bobdiehl_69 " from the SS125A Yahoo group.... It is actually a 160, but looks identical to a 175... I only hope mine looks that nice when done)
 

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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thought process....Opinions wanted!!!!!

Looking at the side-by-side views of the engines, I realized that part of the reason I wanted to use the vertical head was that the finning at the exhaust area projected out, (more like a 305, see really bad pic below)... Since it also has "extra" finning at the intake port side, I could subtly reduce them and get even closer to the 305 look, PLUS, it might then be possible to re-angle the carb mount points and studs (re-tap) to get the correct angle for the hybrid engine.....The alternative would be to fabricate "bent" intake manifolds....



So, what are your opinions?... Am I going too far to get the look?
 

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You've got the talent.

If the result is most important to you, then take the time to get the end result you want.

If getting it done is most important to you, you can settle for the product that you can get done in the alloted time.

The rest of us get to just watch and enjoy! :D
 

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i guess it all depends on the time verse look ratio.... will you need to cast a runner specifically for the application or do you have a piece in mind? or will welding/re-angling the holes suffice? i'd be tempted to mock something up and see if whats involved...
 

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Sensei
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27,180 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
... I'd have to machine half the difference in angles from each part (head and intake), Have the stud holes heli-arced, and re-tap.......or, possibly a wedge shaped adaptor plate of some sort.... Or just make 'bent" ones from scratch (fabbed, not cast)
 

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Steve, THIS is what I've been missing. I wondered if you were ever gonna get back to THIS one. The work that you have already put into it is fantastic. In MY opinion (which I know, only applies to ME), I'd go for what looks BEST and Feels right , To YOU! Keep up the GREAT work! :cool:

Looking Forward to the rest, Bill ;)

BTW, YOUR getting back to THIS build, is Inspiring ME to Pray for warmer weather, so I can get back to making some kind of room so I can get back to the Super Hawk build, that is not ANYWHERE near the level that YOURS is. :roll:
 
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