[Scootingeezer]

Hi everyone! Long time motorbike enthusiast. My next project is to resurrect my old 67 CL77 I've had since 1977. Ran great 20 years ago but obviously many things need attention. I was hoping to get some ideas where to buy parts here in the US. I'll be hunting basic carb kits or whatever seals and gaskets I can find, petcock assy or kit, air cleaner to carb rubbers, gas cap or cap seal and so on. Any suggestions would be great. Always hoping for OEM Honda or suggested good replacement aftermarket. Thanks so much in advance and I will do my best to offer up whatever knowledge I can provide in return (I think there's some left up there ).

 

[01-7700]

Welcome !

 

[DD23]

Hi scoot,

Another one stored for twenty years.....

You will know that bikes/machinery in hibernation suffer with things that stick.

Cables, carbs, clutches, VALVES, and now gearboxes !

Valves,
a stuck valve, open usually, will turn a viable engine to scrap in one stroke, so be warned !!!

Before you do anything to the engine you must check valve operation else run the very real risk of expensive/terminal damage.

If you need advise on how to check, just ask.

An hour spent now ( a stitch in time saves 900 bucks ) will be time very well spent.

Do you have a manual for your bike please ?

I suggest you read all of suejenn's threads about his 305. There are a few now ( 3 seperate threads if I remember correctly ) but I will post info for you in a bit.

You know of CMSNL.com, partzilla, davidsilverspares ( they have a USA branch apparently ) and no doubt a few other USA suppliers.

Visit CMSNL, you may be delighted...

Post some pictures, as seen in hibernation, some "before" pictures. Use the paper clip in the tool bar just below the text box.

Feed back please as it's polite and helps others.

I know you will be fully aware of the saying " hare and tortoiuse"...

Welcome aboard.

Dd23

 

[Honda John]

Greetings Geezer, all the items you mentioned are available. Also there are some upgrades that can improve your CL77. I've done 2 CL77 restorations (early & late) since retirement in 2016.
Good Luck, HondaJohn

 

[DD23]

Nice ones honda John. Do you have a manual of these bikes to possibly help out suejenn and geezer and others ?

Geezer ( that names Gunna stick now ) I am sure suejenn has started 3 threads about his 305, in the last 2 months or so.

The first one which I cannot find was about gear selection trouble.

The second one titled " How to remove old oil crud inside engine case of 65. 305 dream"

The latest one titled "1965 305 dream need to replace shifter drum for sure and maybe more stuff"

Your 20 years in hibernation bike may be similarly affected.

Your priority is to establish if the valves operate properly, or is one ( or more ) "stuck". This is a very important first check to do.

Read suejenn's threads...

Dd23

 

[DD23]

Another of suejenn's related thread, "65 305 dream won't shift due to shift drum rust...any ideas "...

Another thread " 305 dream 1965 won't go in gear"

And another " 1965 305 dream oil pump screen had completely deteriorated"

Suejenn's threads seem to start January 2nd, 2023, so are fresh.

 

[Scootingeezer]

Thanks all for the feedback and suggestions, not to mention places to source parts. Just retired in December and finally have time for projects. DD23 I hadn't really thought about stuck valves but you have my attention. I would appreciate your approach to that if and when you have time. I'm no Smokey Yunick but have a decent understanding about motors. I guess I could bring the engine to TDC and pull a compression check or use a leak down tester. Today I got rolling and pulled the seat, tank, exhaust, air boxes, carbs and petcock. Yes, the carbs needed a good dose of PB Blaster to get those slides loosened up for the tear down before headed into the carb cleaner. Honda John those are beautiful bikes and thanks for posting!

Geezer

 

[Honda John]

Hello, looks like you have a good starting point for a restoration.
Many items needed for a machine that old to make it reliable and safe.
Depending on budget available can influence how deep the restoration goes, and your level of expertise, what you can perform and what you need to have done for you.
I think all possible trouble- spots should be inspected, cleaned, lubed, or replaced. Things like cables, wheel bearings, swing arm bushings, tires and tubes, steering head bearings, chain and sprockets, brake pivot shafts.
Modern upgrades, like regulator/rectifier update, (a major charge system improvement) or electronic ignition, modern ignition coils that will make it a 1 kicker.
All that and we have not mentioned the engine.
I would expect that 50-year-old gaskets and oil seals need replacement, with a close inspection and cleaning of all engine components. Disassembly of cylinder head, removal of valves, clean and inspect, repeat...4 new cam bearings, new cam chain.
Its not hard to take a year to complete depending how detailed you get. The trick is to accept delays, they will happen, take your time, and try to enjoy the process.
Places that can help;
"4into1" gasket sets, carb kits, petcock kits, oil seal kits, spark plugs, many OE Honda parts.
"Charlies Place" electronic ignition, hi output coils.
"Scrambler Cycle" gaskets, seals, OE reproduction cast piston kits,
"Claussstudios.com" rubber parts made in L.A., Ca. lifetime warranty.
"Classic Honda Restoration" Case screw sets, control cable sets, Hi perf forged pistons,
"Pops Honda ebay store" NOS, OE parts.
The internet has helped all these places to thrive and reach customer at home on the net.
I have used these companies, and a dozen more, and was treated well.
Ebay and the internet will help you get the job done. Good Luck, HondaJohn

 

[DD23]

Hi geezer,

Is it me or are the pictures of hj's text blurred ?

Stuck valves.

To me, fitting a good battery to a bike that's been in hibernation for some time, 20 years in this instance, and pressing the starter button to whiz the engine over, is folly. Even using a kick starter to turn engine over is equally folly in my opinion.

The valves on most bike engines are "inclined", meaning they are not inline with the piston.

A rising piston coming into contact with a stuck open valve will tend to want to bend the stuck valve, even breaking a valve guide.

An hour spent checking for stuck valves before turning the engine over could save 49 or more hours and many many many bucks needed to rectify your impatience.

Hare and tourtoiuse comes to mind.

So, plugs out, ideally carbs and exhaust off and valve covers off, so the rocker arms can be seen and felt.

Access to the crank needed via alternater rotor. A spanner/socket can get used to turn the crank but turning the crank by hand is better giving more "feel" and less grip, so limited turning force.

Cylinders, valve guides, valve stems and rockers well soaked repeatedly with penetrant, giving it time to do it's thing. You did drain the old engine oil and examine for glitter ? You now see penetrant dripping out of the sump plug hole ?

Get some extra eyes.

You are now finally ready to check valve operation.

With eyes on looking, rockers being watched and felt for play and movement, crank being very slowly turned with minimum force, check valves open and close.

Any increasing rocker arm play is a good indication of a valve being stuck open.

If the crank seems to want to stop rotating, and a "dunk" sort of noise heard, STOP !

A valve may be making contact with a piston crown. Look down the spark plug hole...

Even an opening valve making contact with a stuck open valve can happen

If you are 100 per cent sure that all valves are opening and closing properly, with no hint of sticking, then you are closer to a safer for the engine start up.

Sometimes the merest contact with a stuck valve can cause it to "snap shut" with a "quite loud slamming shut noise" due to the spring action.

You must satisfy your self that valves open and close properly 100 per cent.

Open valves can suffer, valve seat and valve face "degredation" due to humidity entering the engine particularly with time.

Piston rings also can and do stick.

How to free a stuck open valve ?

Penetrant penetrant penetrant, time, patience and some hot air usually does the trick, along with some very very gentle tapping with a small small small hammer. Suitably protect what you are tapping. Just don't go overdoing the tapping. One or two taps would be sufficient, more than that means head off really.

Clutches and other stuff sticks needing attention prior to trying to select a gear. Only do this with the bike safely on a centre stand, else dentist or glazier may be needed.

You have a swimming pool ?

Seriously consider a full engine strip down.

Geezer, your bike looks very clean etc. for 20 years of storage, but see suejenn's threads about his 20 years of storage dilemma.

Have to admit first time of coming across a badly stuck gearbox on a bike or car for that matter.

A very old elto on the other hand, pistons stuck/corroded solid, crank play movement felt but prop drive gearbox solid.

59 gallons of Coca-Cola needed me thinks. I will test cokes reaction with alloy so maybe 58 gallons of hot oil.

Maybe lemon juice or malasis.

 

[Scootingeezer]

Thank you so much for the responses, information and humor Lol! No we don't have a pool (thank goodness). Not that I'm anti-pool but we live at 7500ft in a pine tree forest. We spend a lot of time maintaining our property dealing with pine needles. After the 2013 fires we bagged up 1300 42 gallon contractor bags of needles so a pool is a NO-GO. I am blown away at the knowledge you guys possess regarding these old Hondas. The info I have already received is invaluable, so thank you again. I have a few old bikes I have had for decades and I thought it would be fun to bring the scrambler back to life first. I did read the post regarding Tom's 20 year storage project and hope mine is more straight forward. I haven't decided how much of a restoration this will be so I'm starting with the basic's to start with first. Does it run, will it shift, what all leaks etc. I considered just buying a totally restored Scrambler or Superhawk (not cheap these days) but why abandon my old 305. Today I did verify the valves are functioning and the motor has compression. I also checked the 4 speed to see if all gears shifted up and down and they do. I spent some money with 4into1 this afternoon for some basic parts to hopefully make her run.

Geezer
1965 CB160
1965 YDS3C Big Bear
1968 R60 BMW

 

[DD23]

Wonderfully.

Clutch free, it may let go by pushing in gear back and forward...holding clutch in...

Oil examined and centrifugal oil filter cleaned, much speckled grey hard paste seen ?

Enjoy, I know your Gunna love it...

 

[Scootingeezer]

Thanks again for getting me on the beginning path. Decided to pull the oil filter cover or entire side cover off. All screws stuck like 50 years old (which they are). Sourced and bought the Vessel Impacta JIS screwdriver. If your eye sight is questionable like mine I highly recommend wearing heavy gloves (good idea with good eye sight too). My only accomplishment was to hit my thumb. Finally used my Blue Point 3/8 pneumatic impact with success (I know why didn't i just use it first). Happy to now have a JIS screwdriver going forward. Draining the oil at first I thought it wasn't all that bad however removing the filter and disassembling showed plenty of that "speckled grey hard paste"! Learning how to source parts using multiple searches has been fun. Thanks again for all the assistance.

 

[DD23]

Hi scoot, may I ask was the clutch stuck ?

Any more pictures....much crap on sump floor ?

It's good valves all free and good compression was achieved ?

Enjoy.

 

[Scootingeezer]

Thanks again for all your help! I did have a chance to get things cleaned up. Slinger, sump, oil pump screen and all actually looked pretty decent considering the time its been down. With fresh fluids, battery charger and a make shift fuel tank I gave it go. Started on the 2nd kick and sounded pretty good. Lucky for me the clutch worked as designed without sticking. Bike seems to shift like it should as well. Cleaned the tank using electrolysis and pretty happy with that as well. Next up new fuel lines, petcock rebuild, new air cleaners/rubbers, battery and maybe some cosmetic upgrades after i ride it on a shakedown run (once it warms up). I'll post some more photos before we head to warmer temps for a few weeks. Cheers!

 

[HenryNorfolk]

Looks like a good project Scootingeezer. I like the rug on your workshop floor. My 1967 CB77 (I bought it in 2021) is a fun bike to ride now that I've got it a bit more sorted, but of course some parts have suffered through ageing. The petrol tank had been welded by a previous owner but I've cleaned it out and applied an epoxy liner to prevent further leaks. Also, the charging system had intermittent faults and finally stopped working. Examining the alternator stator revealed that the insulation on the windings had perished. I'm having it rewound and it's an expensive operation. You might need to do similar.