[One1]

6v Cm200t with no spark. - need a flow chart

I've done some initial tests, as I have experience with 12v bikes with points. I'm no expert. I'm not getting spark and nothing at the points. I did my best to verify everything and here is what I have came up with so far.

- rectifier has power at 2 wires with the switch on. Seems to be working properly, as I can get it to read ohms on 4 pins, but not when I reverse the leads on the DMM. I can also get double the ohms crossing one set of pins jumping over the bridge of the rectifier proving it is a completed circuit internally.

- Ignition coil has resistance on the input side and the output side. I forgot how much, but wasn't a dead short. Had "some" resistance so I figured it's ok.

- Condenser may be bad, but chicken/egg I need to find the flow of voltage and where it stops before I bother with that.

- Electrical flow chart...... that'd be handy. I need to follow it up to where it stops and find out why, but Even though I have traced the wires, I do not know the factors involving where power is split, applied, etc. Anyone wanna take up telling me where i should see 6v at each point?

- Stator appears to be a 2 wire. I have 2 yellow and 2 off color so those should be the pickup. Stator wires are not shorted nor grounded and have conductivity. I forget what the pickup should pulse when rotated, anyone want to refresh me? AC or DC?

I've just received the bike and it hasn't ran in forever. Has high compression on one cyl (120/60) so may have a LOT of carbon on that side or something.... not sure yet I haven't made it that far. I'll tackle that later. My finance's 16 yr old wants a bike and I got this for $50 figuring I'd build it. It's PERFECT for him. Size and weight (and power) for a training wheels bike couldn't be better. I'll just follow him in 3rd gear everywhere on my bike. LOL.


EDIT: here's a pic

 

[longdistancerider]

Welcome aboard, PM sent for the FSM

 

[One1]

Verified the Pickup - putting out DC mv when rotated.

Verified the Stator - putting out ACV when rotated.

Question becomes, why is there no spark.....

What I do not know right now is what should I see at the input of the ignition coil and when. I know the blue feeds to the points and condenser. If the condenser is bad will I still see anything at the ignition?

 

[longdistancerider]

The condenser is basically an electronic muffler for the points, you can remove it for now if it's questionable. It'll cause the point to burn up quicker if left that way.
Compression spec is 170 +/- 28 psi
I'm not clear what you mean by "pickup", that usually refers to a CDI system not points.
Stator should be reading in AC voltage, the rectifier changes it to DC

 

[One1]

I have weak random spark after many many things. Something I noticed, without the battery I have no spark, on a 1/2 amp 6v charger I have weak spark. Is this bike not self supportive without a battery? I figured the stator would put out enough to support spark, but I'm not seeing that.

 

[longdistancerider]

You have to have a fully charged battery for points ignition.

 

[One1]

Never had to deal with that issue before. Interesting to know. I had to pretty much take out everything, clean it, re-align and time it, and put it back together to get any spark out of it. The contacts on the points weren't showing any conductivity even when pressed together - though I'd sanded them yesterday. I ended up dremeling them and putting them back in, with a very tiny amount of grease on the shaft that the rocker arm sits on since it was just lightly trying to grab and keep the contacts from touching. Once they were moving freely and showing conductivity I removed the condenser and dremeled the case and mount to ensure a good ground. The same went on throughout the bike until finally everything was 100% and I began to finally see life in the form of weak spark. I stopped at that point because I knew it was finally alive and I just needed more juice. I figured the battery was needed at this point to go further. My charger is a schumacher 6/12 volt 1/2 amp mini charger I use as a battery tender for my ATV's, street bikes, jet skis, etc. Well, a manual battery tender, as it doesn't have a cut off or conditioning cycle. I just top off everything with it in the winter.

I've built (restored) my grandmothers 1981 Kawi 440 LTD for my uncle and it is points ignition. I had to deal with that last year and learned a lot about points, but we ordered a lot of new things, chiefly among those was a new battery, hence this issue never arose. I have built many 2 and 4 stroke dirt bikes, atv's, and a couple 2 stroke jet skis in the small engine category so I've done a lot mechanically and used to work on automotive electrical when I owned security stores. Actually have a degree in electronics and am fiber optic certified so I know how to troubleshoot things, but I also know when to ask questions...... LOL. If I am in unfamiliar territory I'm not afraid to ask. Points ignition is definitely one of those things. 6 volt systems is something else I have not had a lot of experience with. I had a 1950 Pontiac SilverStreak Streamliner Deluxe (seriously it's name) Three on the tree, straight-8, and 6 volts of fury (lol). I converted it to 12 volts very shortly after getting it so didn't have much time with the 6 volt system.

 

[longdistancerider]

The truth is there's no difference between 6V, 12V or 24V in DC circuits. They all do exactly the same thing. The differences that exist are related to resistances and construction. IE; a 6V bulb has the thinner element that a 12V.
Even positive earth systems are the same, just reversed polarity.

 

[One1]

She's alive.

 

[CL450_RIDER]

Hello

Welcome aboard, PM sent for the FSM

Hi, I'm also trying to sort out a 1980 CM200T with several electrical gremlins. Would it be possible to get the FSM for this bike? Thanks!

 

[longdistancerider]

PM sent

 

[Canadian]

Hi, I'm also trying to sort out a 1980 CM200T with several electrical gremlins. Would it be possible to get the FSM for this bike? Thanks!

Just ran into the same issues. Would greatly appreciate the FSM!

 

[longdistancerider]

PM sent

 

[cloutier172]

I know this is an older post but I am in the same boat. I just picked up a CM200t with no spark. I have started working through checking the common sense items like kill switch and fuses. I am not having luck. I have some voltage coming to the coil but no spark. Does anyone have the service manual and know what the input voltage to the coil should be?

 

[Dholland]

My cm200t is my first bike and I've been troubleshooting all the repairs and upkeep on her , well I have no spark and am stuck as to what to do next do I need to replace ignition coil, I'm thinking my coil was fried when a friend who was helping me killed the battery and I can't seem to find a service manual anywhere.

 

[Dholland]

PM sent

I could use the FSM too please