[Tmike]

Called a rejuvenation versus restoration because, at this time at least, I'm not certain exactly what will be done beyond a good running bike. It hasn't been ridden with any regularity since 2009 but "started and run fairly regularly, just not sure how long ago". Will be starting with lubrication of the cylinders, cranking with the kick starter, cleaning fuel system including tank, petcock and filters. Changing what oil is remaining, cleaning the filter, and battery.
Any other preliminary suggestions before digging deeper?
Thanks for any assistance. I've done a bit of maintenance on more modern bikes but never any kind of restoration.
I strictly abide by words of the famous Clint Eastwood: "A man's got to know his limitations..." Learned the hard way.

 

[Tmike]

I'll work on the pictures

 

[ancientdad]

I'll work on the pictures

no worries - at least you didn't post them and say "I don't know why...". If you're working from a computer, just import all of them and make sure they are properly oriented there before upload (but if it's Windows 10, it might still fool you, Win10 auto-corrects in its viewer and they might still need re-orientation)

There's also this for some explanation

https://www.hondatwins.net/forums/25-website-issues/120382-pictures-post-upside-down.html#post1008568

 

[pemdoc65]

I found that with my iphone, the pictures upload in the correct orientation if taken in landscape mode vs portrait mode. Something to do with software and tags and geek stuff. I was getting fooled by my macbook, which showed the pictures in the correct orientation until I posted them. Then they were sideways.

 

[Tmike]

Finally warmed up enough to get a start, slowly. Mostly up close inspection that showed very little rust or deterioration. Carb supply lines had been disconnected, battery disconnected, oil appears brand new topped and maybe slightly overfilled according to the dipstick. Both plugs are black, tank has very small spots of what looks like surface rust and petcock operates freely. With side covers and tank removed it's relatively clean with no signs of rodent habitat, real rust or corrosion. Wiring looks good, air cleaners fairly clean and carbs look almost new they're so clean. It appears he spent a bit of time preparing it for long term storage. The worst component is the seat pan. I'll be taking that to a buddy seat fabricator this afternoon for his opinion.
Based on these findings of no real rust how would you prepare the cylinders prior to kicking over? I'd considered a bit of 30 wt. oil but wonder if that's necessary now and maybe a squirt of WD40 would suffice. I'm thinking that, a new battery and plugs may result in a good start but aware I'm likely overlooking some things. I'll post some pictures later.
Thoughts?

 

[ancientdad]

I would still use a tablespoon of Marvel Mystery oil in the cylinders and let it sit for a day or two to help free up potentially-stuck piston rings, which really would probably be the only thing other than the clutch plates sticking together (which can happen if a bike sits for a month or two)

 

[frogman79]

Might pull the cam covers and squirt some oil on the the cams prior to start, 450s take a good minute to get oil up there and running dry they can do a bit of damage.

Where in CO are you at Mike?

 

[Tmike]

Marvel it is. Better then WD40 I'm sure.
Will do on the cams as well. Amazingly the battery shows 5.5 volts so I'll put it on the charger and see what happens. It looks fairly new.
My seat guy is pessimistic on the pan rebuild due to major corrosion of the edges. By far the worst condition component. What have folks done to replace the seat hardware? Ebuy has complete seats for under $300 that makes me question the quality.
I'm in Fort Collins... Towards the mountains from you there in Greeley. I make the trek over there on occasion to visit Weldworks Brewery. Good stuff.

 

[nigelrharris03]

Definitely clean out the oil spinner and change the oil before starting. Check the cam chain tension, check the valve clearances.

 

[Tmike]

Definitely clean out the oil spinner and change the oil before starting. Check the cam chain tension, check the valve clearances.

Yes, failed to mention that but certainly will change the oil (despite how good it looks, no idea how old it is) and clean the filter as well as cam chain and valves.
Thanks

 

[ancientdad]

Be careful to put the small, 3 screw oil filter cover back on with the same orientation of the 2 holes on the inside edges - they are passages in and out of the filter body through the larger clutch cover and if you turn it a third of a turn inadvertently, the holes won't line up (but the screws will) and it will block oil flow to practically everything in the engine. And yes, I can't believe I forgot to mention the slow movement of oil to the top end parts from the oil pump up through the 2 right-hand cylinder studs... run the engine as slow as possible for the first couple of minutes to avoid quickly wearing away any oil clinging from your squirt-can lube of the cams and followers, since no residual oil is held below the cams on this engine. (good catch, frogman!)

 

[frogman79]

Be careful to put the small, 3 screw oil filter cover back on with the same orientation of the 2 holes on the inside edges - they are passages in and out of the filter body through the larger clutch cover and if you turn it a third of a turn inadvertently, the holes won't line up (but the screws will) and it will block oil flow to practically everything in the engine. And yes, I can't believe I forgot to mention the slow movement of oil to the top end parts from the oil pump up through the 2 right-hand cylinder studs... run the engine as slow as possible for the first couple of minutes to avoid quickly wearing away any oil clinging from your squirt-can lube of the cams and followers, since no residual oil is held below the cams on this engine. (good catch, frogman!)

There is a way to somewhat pre-lube the engine if you have a decent oil can (what). That hole in the case where the filter cover has to line up to, the one that goes up into the right side cover, you can rig up something that will connect to that hole and just pump away until you get oil at the cams. That way most of the internal passages will have been filled. Or you can just run the starter for 30 second bursts with a pause to let it cool off until you have oil flow. They do really take a long time to get oil up, you will notice an audible change in how the engine sounds when its running when that happens.

We should to get together one of these days when the weather is nicer. I do have a bit of knowledge about these engines, have 1 built from a pile of parts, and a few spare parts that I managed to bring up from Oklahoma when I moved. Granted its 5-speed stuff but some if it interchanges.

I need to get my toys figured out if they are going to bed down for the winter or if I am going to try to ride them once in a while. Have yet to go to Weldworks, been to the brewery up the road from me, it was kinda meh, Broken Plow I believe it is called. I have my own brewing setup so make what I want.

 

[nigelrharris03]

The oil spinner requires a threaded bolt to push out the central section from memory for the later bikes its an 8mm metric thread. Use a long bolt at least 50mm machine bolt threaded all the way along. See attached pictures.

 

[ancientdad]

There is a way to somewhat pre-lube the engine if you have a decent oil can (what). That hole in the case where the filter cover has to line up to, the one that goes up into the right side cover, you can rig up something that will connect to that hole and just pump away until you get oil at the cams. That way most of the internal passages will have been filled. Or you can just run the starter for 30 second bursts with a pause to let it cool off until you have oil flow. They do really take a long time to get oil up, you will notice an audible change in how the engine sounds when its running when that happens.

Franz, I've been saying that last part for decades - if you listen carefully to a 450 engine idling when cold, you can actually hear a change in the "hissing" noise it makes as oil flow arrives at the top end roughly a minute to a minute and a half after start. that's a good idea about using the outgoing oil passage in the cover to pre-lube the top end, although you'd have to squirt a lot of oil since that also is divided between the crank and trans at the side of the upper case as well IIRC. When I have the engine ready to start but with the exhaust valve cover still off, I use a squirt can of oil and pump it into one of the orifices in the exhaust cam lobes while covering the other... it fills the cam and goes out into the bearing caps and down the studs and trickles out of the orifices in the lobes to the followers as you're putting the last valve cover on right before startup

 

[Tmike]

Thanks much for the invaluable pre-oiling tips and information. I'm fortunate to have a Honda shop manual and Clymer manual but they can't replace the hands on information you guys provide. Will spend some time today rounding up some things to accomplish that prior to the start attempt.
Yes, Frogman I'd like very much to get together some time. Showing 48 degrees at 10 AM so I'll definitely be out on a bike to round up parts this afternoon.

 

[ancientdad]

I know it's a long read, but I ran into many of these things in my build, skim over it to see some of the pics of things I encountered - including the oil pressure valve on the 3 screw oil filter cover. If you decide to take that apart to clean it up, pay close attention to the proper assembly

 

[Tmike]

Gonna try some pictures to illustrate how clean it is.

 

[ancientdad]

It is, especially for its age. And, it looks like the left intake cam bearing screws have never been touched. You expect the alternator cover, points cover and front sprocket cover screws to have been removed for regular maintenance, starter clutch repair and chain/sprockets

 

[frogman79]

Clutch cable holder is fancy

 

[pemdoc65]

I was wondering about that clutch cable holder also. I've not seen one like that before, but I like it. What is it attached to?