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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello, I have a 78 Hawk that has something going on with the clutch. I recently replaced the clutch cable to take care of the loose clutch lever, and it didn't quite work out. The clutch is still very loose, and I'm running out of adjustment at the handlebar lever. I've already gone ahead and ordered a new clutch plates and springs (EBC), clutch lever spring, and other assorted parts that may be needed for the repair, but am looking to see if there is something that I am missing. I'll be doing all of the work myself, I'm very comfortable working on things like this having worked on cars since I was 16. Attached are some photos of the handlebar lever, clutch lever, and adjuster.
Thanks,
Sal

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Do you have a copy of the service manual? I can't remember off the top of my head so I'm using it as a guide but it appears to show that the adjustment at the clutch is at the loosest possible position.

I could be wrong though but other than that I can't see anything missing in the clutch cable side of things. Can't tell about routing either, that could make a difference as well if it's off.
 

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The clutch cable looks ok for free length. There's too much free movement in the release mechanism and you're using all the cable adjustment to take up the slack. Take the right cover off and check out the release arm for wear. Also check the clutch lifter, where the release arm runs against, it for wear.
 

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The cable at the lever appears to be cross-threaded. It does not align properly with the perch.

Other than that, it appears you have more adjustment available at the engine end of the cable. That's where to start.

Do you have the factory service manual?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I do not have a copy of the service manual, is there a specific one I should look for? J-T, I just checked, and yes, it was cross threaded. The first quarter of the threads are all chewed up and no longer functional. If I screw it in about halfway, it goes in straight just like it should, but then the hand lever is very loose and sloppy. Something else that may be of importance is that the hand lever is very loose up and down, like there is too much clearance between its slot and the lever itself. As far as adjustment on the engine side of things, I did adjust it about as far as it would go that way, and all tension was lost. Also, should the clutch lever (engine side) be at more of an angle? Looking at some pictures, most bikes I see have it at more of a 10-11 o'clock angle vs the 12 that mine is. mike in Idaho, do you know the part numbers for the parts you are referring to so I can order replacements if needed, and see the parts diagrams so I know what they are?
 

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Your certainly loosing some "mechanical advantage" on the engine clutch lever, due possibly to worn clutch friction plates etc., as well as other possible reasons. You have a manual which is always good, and hopefully know of cmsnl for the very informative and complementary.

Have you had the cover off before and does the clutch slip??

You will need the peg spanner for the clutch nut and can use the gearbox and rear brake to "lock" the gearbox input shaft for undoing the nut.

Before you remove the clutch cover, degrease and really clean out the covered oil pressure switch area asi ti fills with road dirt and grit etc, which lands on the crank gear when the cover is removed.

When the clutch cover is off, that is the ideal time to flush out the sump of all the debris that is lying on in and in the labarynth. Don't forget the kick start oil trough also. Its better to low pressure flush the sump floor rather than high pressure which tends to splatter the crap everywhere inside the engine.

Post a picture of before and after clutch basket/drum finger inner surfaces to show centrifugal crap trap effect, for others and the "thomases" to see.

Keep everything in order so the go back in the correct place, if they are in the correct place to start with, but mainly ENJOY.

I have yet to see the needle roller bearing having broken up, or the "release bearing " for that matter, but a new one of those may be needed, the small ball race bearing that is.

Also whilst the cover is off, attend to the balance chain and the adjustable adjusting quadrant.

What colour is the present clutch cover gasket?

OE green ones have heat activated adhesive so will tear on removal. I tend to either make my own and glue the area under/by the oil pressure switch for good measure, even oe ones. You will see why when the cover is off.

Do your research and take your time, and ENJOY.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Your certainly loosing some "mechanical advantage" on the engine clutch lever, due possibly to worn clutch friction plates etc., as well as other possible reasons. You have a manual which is always good, and hopefully know of cmsnl for the very informative and complementary.

Have you had the cover off before and does the clutch slip??

You will need the peg spanner for the clutch nut and can use the gearbox and rear brake to "lock" the gearbox input shaft for undoing the nut.

Before you remove the clutch cover, degrease and really clean out the covered oil pressure switch area asi ti fills with road dirt and grit etc, which lands on the crank gear when the cover is removed.

When the clutch cover is off, that is the ideal time to flush out the sump of all the debris that is lying on in and in the labarynth. Don't forget the kick start oil trough also. Its better to low pressure flush the sump floor rather than high pressure which tends to splatter the crap everywhere inside the engine.

Post a picture of before and after clutch basket/drum finger inner surfaces to show centrifugal crap trap effect, for others and the "thomases" to see.

Keep everything in order so the go back in the correct place, if they are in the correct place to start with, but mainly ENJOY.

I have yet to see the needle roller bearing having broken up, or the "release bearing " for that matter, but a new one of those may be needed, the small ball race bearing that is.

Also whilst the cover is off, attend to the balance chain and the adjustable adjusting quadrant.

What colour is the present clutch cover gasket?

OE green ones have heat activated adhesive so will tear on removal. I tend to either make my own and glue the area under/by the oil pressure switch for good measure, even oe ones. You will see why when the cover is off.

Do your research and take your time, and ENJOY.

Yes, the clutch does slip, that is the other reason that I tried to adjust the clutch. I figured that the plates were worn out after 26000 miles so I already went ahead and ordered a new set of plates and springs.

I found a copy of the Shop service manual online that I will use for instructions, as well as things like adjusting the cam chain, valve clearance, and other necessary adjustments.

I have never taken that side cover off since I don't have any parts to replace in their yet. Other items I've purchased for the repair include the clutch lever spring, side cover gasket, and o rings and such.

Is there anything else I should look for while I'm in there? You mention flushing out the sump and kick starter oil trough, where would I find directions for this? Is this something that I just go at with some shop towels, wiping out the debris and sludge until it looks clean?

I've got the bike running pretty well right now, the previous owner completely messed up the choke and idle circuits, so I too the carbs off, completely disassembled, ultrasonic cleaned, and rebuilt with new gaskets, air cut offs, and one step larger main jets. I also threw in new plugs, the tips were completely burnt off of the old ones and now it starts and runs much better.

None of the repair will be happening this week, I'm actually towing the bike down to Nashville TN next week to put in a storage space until I move down there in April. I have plenty of time to collect parts now, so please let me know what else I should do while I'm in there.

Also, since I managed to strip out the adjuster screw on the hand lever... Anyone know where I can get another one?
 

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You have a manual which is good, but find your exact bike on cmsnl and look at/study/print off the exploded views as they contain lots of info once you know how to read them.

Research about the balance shaft and chain adjustment, a job to do when the clutch cover is off.

As the bike is low mileage I doubt its been apart before and has green clutch cover and cylinder base gaskets??

Any sign of an oil leak between the front cylinders??

You have the clutch peg spanner, they are available as reasonable cost, or make your own.

If the clutch nut has been "butchered" then someone has been in side the engine before you who was........well, not good.

You may think about replacing the small ball race clutch release bearing.

Cleaning out the sump and kick start oil trough. I assume you do not have a compressor, but have good tools ( hexagon sockets are very useful, as are thin walled long 10mm sockets and JIS screwdrivers ) and a good place to work. Your workshop looks big enough.

Solvents are good at flushing out the sump, along with washing up liquid squeezy bottles and suitable tubing to get into the knooks and cranneis, and the kick start oil trough. You will see "openings" when the clutch cover is off for access to the sump floor etc..

When you drain the engine oil, examine to see whats come out, especially the "dregs" looking for metalic bits and rubber bits.

You can lean the bike over when flushing out the sump to encourage the solvent to flow out taking dirt etc. with it.

Make sure all the solvent is out of the k/start oil trough.

Solvent may be flammable to take all safety precautions, you don't want to set your workshop and contents on fire do you.

With cam cover off ( if your fighting it your doing it wrong ) the cam oil troughs etc can be flushed with solvent going to sump via the cam chain tunnel. Don't forget to lube the cam chain after.

Research cam and balance chain adjustment and the "DOT", i will leave you to find out that.

To lock the clutch hub use the gearbox and rear brake, a high gear. You have a torque wrench to do things up properly??

One more thing, any sign of oil leakage from the oil pressure switch, and protect the workshop floor with cardboard or old carpet.

Research and enjoy, and take your time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
You have a manual which is good, but find your exact bike on cmsnl and look at/study/print off the exploded views as they contain lots of info once you know how to read them.

Research about the balance shaft and chain adjustment, a job to do when the clutch cover is off.

As the bike is low mileage I doubt its been apart before and has green clutch cover and cylinder base gaskets??

Any sign of an oil leak between the front cylinders??

You have the clutch peg spanner, they are available as reasonable cost, or make your own.

If the clutch nut has been "butchered" then someone has been in side the engine before you who was........well, not good.

You may think about replacing the small ball race clutch release bearing.

Cleaning out the sump and kick start oil trough. I assume you do not have a compressor, but have good tools ( hexagon sockets are very useful, as are thin walled long 10mm sockets and JIS screwdrivers ) and a good place to work. Your workshop looks big enough.

Solvents are good at flushing out the sump, along with washing up liquid squeezy bottles and suitable tubing to get into the knooks and cranneis, and the kick start oil trough. You will see "openings" when the clutch cover is off for access to the sump floor etc..

When you drain the engine oil, examine to see whats come out, especially the "dregs" looking for metalic bits and rubber bits.

You can lean the bike over when flushing out the sump to encourage the solvent to flow out taking dirt etc. with it.

Make sure all the solvent is out of the k/start oil trough.

Solvent may be flammable to take all safety precautions, you don't want to set your workshop and contents on fire do you.

With cam cover off ( if your fighting it your doing it wrong ) the cam oil troughs etc can be flushed with solvent going to sump via the cam chain tunnel. Don't forget to lube the cam chain after.

Research cam and balance chain adjustment and the "DOT", i will leave you to find out that.

To lock the clutch hub use the gearbox and rear brake, a high gear. You have a torque wrench to do things up properly??

One more thing, any sign of oil leakage from the oil pressure switch, and protect the workshop floor with cardboard or old carpet.

Research and enjoy, and take your time.

I have not pulled the cover off to see the gasket, but I did order a new one since I'm sure it'll rip during the removal process.

You are correct that I do not have a compressor, but I have more hand tools that I know what to do with!

I have already changed the oil, and it was full of silvery metallic particles. According to the previous owner, it hadn't been changed in... wait for it... 10 years. I took it off of the truck and did an oil change right when I got it home. No huge chunks of anything as far as I could tell though.

Cam and balance chain - I've already studied those pages in the service manual. Will be taking care of those along with another oil change first thing when I get the bike to Nashville next week.

Ill use 4th or 5th to lock the hub when doing the clutch. And yes, I have a few torque wrenches.

No signs of any crazy leakage from anywhere on the engine, though I still haven't cleaned it off too well to get a good look. Ill do that next week as well.

Not so much mechanical issues here, but the bike is also going to get a fresh set of fork ears for the headlight since the ones on there are broken, having been welded back together a few times.

Thanks for the help!
 
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