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Thread: EE hlep needed

  1. #11
    Senior Member dtsmjr8dan's Avatar
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    Yes, Ted. I do wish they'd fix that restriction for uploading.

    Thank you for posting it.
    1979 CM400T (rider),
    1981 CM400T (in surgery receiving transplant)
    1982 CM450 (parts bike)
    1982 CB450 (parts bike)
    Past rides: Vincents, Triumph, BSA's, Suzuki's, Twingle, Corgy, others.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member Bill H's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info and the help. I pretty much understand the cdi system but just found out today there was a alt current cdi system. Didnt now how the alt was charging the coils with alt current. Anyway my problem is why there are two scr gates and why they need 7.5 degrees at tdc for idle and 15 degrees under load. Also why the there is not enough time for the condenser to be charged when the 7.5 signal reaches the scr 1. What is a condenser changing coil and how does it relate to the ignition coils. I have a 1978 Honda hawk cb400t and cb400a shop manual with elec dia. I would like to thank everybody for helping me out.

    Thanks Bill

  3. #13
    Super Moderator longdistancerider's Avatar
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    Here's the scans of the Manual and Automatic CDI's
    EE hlep needed-cdi-1a.jpeg

    EE hlep needed-cdi-2a.jpeg
    Jim O'Brien
    1979 CM400T "road bike" modified for travelling
    1978 CB400T1 restored
    1972 CL350 survivor restoration

    SALE IS ACTIVE TILL 200 SHIRTS SOLD T-shirt sales supporting 66Sprint's Land Speed Record Build http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html

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  5. #14
    Super Moderator longdistancerider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill H View Post
    Thanks for the info and the help. I pretty much understand the cdi system but just found out today there was a alt current cdi system. Didnt now how the alt was charging the coils with alt current. Anyway my problem is why there are two scr gates and why they need 7.5 degrees at tdc for idle and 15 degrees under load. Also why the there is not enough time for the condenser to be charged when the 7.5 signal reaches the scr 1. What is a condenser changing coil and how does it relate to the ignition coils. I have a 1978 Honda hawk cb400t and cb400a shop manual with elec dia. I would like to thank everybody for helping me out.

    Thanks Bill
    x
    The timing difference I'm not sure about, the change from 7.5 to 15 is to increase the idle speed under load when put into gear.
    The charge time for the coil is in milliseconds but there's not enough time between the 7.5 and 15+ to recharge the coil.
    Not sure what the change coil is about but it's not part of the actual coil.
    I've never had an A model to play around with so my information is purely book learning
    Jim O'Brien
    1979 CM400T "road bike" modified for travelling
    1978 CB400T1 restored
    1972 CL350 survivor restoration

    SALE IS ACTIVE TILL 200 SHIRTS SOLD T-shirt sales supporting 66Sprint's Land Speed Record Build http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html

    http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html and http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/1-p...r-attempt.html
    Road Trip http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/11-...here-i-go.html or "where's Jim now?"
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  6. #15
    Senior Member Bill H's Avatar
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    Hi Jim. Yea Im in the same boat as far as the info goes. I pretty much know what I can do and not do and could walk away but you know I just cant leave it alone. There is something Im not seeing and it bugs the heck out of me.I will keep digging and sooner or later I will know how it works. There is little Jap bike builder somewhere laughing his tail off.

    If I ever put the pieces together Ill will let you and Dan know.


    Thanks again, Bill

  7. #16
    Senior Member Bill H's Avatar
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    Hey Jim and Dan if this is not right its as close as I can come. When the bike is in neutral the power flows from the change relay transistor to the starter switch and the starter will work. When in gear the the power goes to ground. The bike can be kick started. When the kickstand is down the same transistor grounds out the SCR1 switch and wont allow the motor to run.

    Also when in neutral the change relay transistor is on. this grounds the SCR2 gate and only the 7.5 degree signal is sent from the fixed pulser to the SCR 1 gate. Firing takes place at 7.5 degrees BTDC. The SCR 2 gate is triggered when the transmission is put in gear sending both the 7.5 and 15 degree signals to SCR 1 gate. Firing then takes place at 15 degrees BTDC because the !5 degree signal reaches the gate first.Other than that its a basic CDI unit.

    On the electric dia for the condenser changing coil read capacitor.

    Bii

  8. #17
    Super Moderator longdistancerider's Avatar
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    Reading diodes, capacitors, transistors, etc is not my strong suit but that sounds right.
    Jim O'Brien
    1979 CM400T "road bike" modified for travelling
    1978 CB400T1 restored
    1972 CL350 survivor restoration

    SALE IS ACTIVE TILL 200 SHIRTS SOLD T-shirt sales supporting 66Sprint's Land Speed Record Build http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html

    http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html and http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/1-p...r-attempt.html
    Road Trip http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/11-...here-i-go.html or "where's Jim now?"
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  9. #18
    Super Moderator longdistancerider's Avatar
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    Here's a basic description of the ignition system from another source, Scientific Design of Intake and Exhaust Systems. Note that this was related to the racing ignition system used by Maserati. They quit racing in 1958
    EE hlep needed-201_5416.jpgEE hlep needed-201_5417.jpg
    Jim O'Brien
    1979 CM400T "road bike" modified for travelling
    1978 CB400T1 restored
    1972 CL350 survivor restoration

    SALE IS ACTIVE TILL 200 SHIRTS SOLD T-shirt sales supporting 66Sprint's Land Speed Record Build http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html

    http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/22-...d-attempt.html and http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/1-p...r-attempt.html
    Road Trip http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/11-...here-i-go.html or "where's Jim now?"
    Member Map http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/dcMembermap.php

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